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 Post subject: Sen. Leahy's "Truth Commission" a response to criticism
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 5:07 pm 
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We should support Senator Leahy's proposal for a "Truth Commission" despite its toothless appearance. I will respond to Jesse Richard's (TVNewsLies) accusation that such a commission would be a "sham."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OzZFuGGR ... gspot.com/


I agree with Richard that it has all the potential of being a "white wash" and ineffectual, but we must pursue this and support it anyway.

1. This is the only game in town
2. It is politically acceptable to a majority
3. It will expose further the criminal nature of the state
4. It will meet with intense opposition from the perps, as it puts them on the defensive. They may commit perjury, obstruction of justice, or other new crimes which are indicted.
5. Those who refuse to testify would be open to prosecution
6. Exposed crimes will lead to evidence of other crimes
7. Exposed crimes will destroy the credibility of the perps
8. Exposing their crimes will turn the public and Congress further against them
9. As knowledge of crimes snowballs, a sea change may occur, as with Richard Nixon. Nixon was elected in one of the most sweeping majorities in history in 1972. Two years later he ran away from the white house to avoid impeachment.
10. Leahy himself may get on board more serious crimes like the anthrax attacks and 9/11. He was personally targeted for assassination by anthrax, and he knows full well that some lone-nut scientist with no motive was not behind it.
11. It is necessary to convince the apathetic public how egregious the situation is before anything substantial can be done. A result of this commission would be to educate the ignorant and apathetic about some truths they are blissfully unaware. As 9/11 was at its core a psy-op to manipulate the public toward aggressive war, such a truth commission could counter this previous programming.
12. Inspiring millions to complain to the Justice Department and demand "justice" is what is needed. This has not occurred on a massive scale (I couldn't even get my blog urging this posted as a sticky on the 911blogger homepage).
13. Simultaneous criminal prosecutions are not precluded, and they may force more disclosures and more testimony so that the full extent of the covert crimes is exposed. Rats turning on one another is exactly what is needed.
14. And most importantly: THE US CONGRESS CANNOT GRANT IMMUNITY FROM PROSECUTION IN INTERNATIONAL COURTS. Exposing evidence of Crimes Against the Peace and Crimes Against Humanity will aid international jurors in forming legal cases against the high criminals from the former US regime, as well as send a clear warning to the current US regime and future US regimes. This in and of itself is the most compelling reason to support the politically tenable investigations of the Bush regime, despite some token grants of immunity by the Senate.

http://crimesofthestate.blogspot.com/20 ... se-to.html

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 Post subject: Re: Sen. Leahy's "Truth Commission" a response to criticism
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 6:35 pm 
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I must agree with Jesse on this one. This will be the "Whitewash Commission." The current hearings going on in Congress about the politicization of the Justice Department which has the full power of subpoena and swearing in of witnesses, has reached a "compromise" with Karl Rove and Harriet Meyers where they give their testimony in secret executive session. If a fully empowered Congressional Committee fails to compel full and open testimony, what basis is there to believe that a totally toothless "Truth Commission" can do anything better?


johndoraemi wrote:
5. Those who refuse to testify would be open to prosecution

12. Inspiring millions to complain to the Justice Department and demand "justice" is what is needed. This has not occurred on a massive scale (I couldn't even get my blog urging this posted as a sticky on the 911blogger homepage).


As to point 5, prosecution for what exactly? This "Commission" has no legal basis to compel sworn testimony. If you think the Repugs blocked the stimulus package, wait and see how they can obstruct any attempt to give this Commission any teeth.

As for point 12, the fix is in. People are much more concerned with their next paycheck, roof over their heads and their next meal to concern themselves about the crimes of the War Chimp and regime. Remember over 50 million voted for McCain/Pallin to continue right down the same road.

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 Post subject: As Opposed To?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 5:52 pm 
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Neither you nor Jesse have offered an alternative to Leahy's proposal.

Your response is particularly defeatist and unhelpful. It's borderline nihilist.

This partisan nonsense about "rethugs" and "war chimp" is also useless. The Democrats are as responsible as the Republicans for the mountains of corpses the US leaves around the world. Both are parties of war criminals. Obama has set his course to continue the tradition of illegal aggressive war. He also retains the program of CIA "rendition" which is subcontracting torture to US client regimes. I'm not sure what the meaning of your banner at the end is, with Obama's face.

Truth is good. If Leahy can get some revealed, that is a start. The alternative is ... nothing.

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 Post subject: Re: Sen. Leahy's "Truth Commission" a response to criticism
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 6:28 pm 
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While I agree that the "Truth Commission" is, at least presently, the "only game in town," I think it should begin with a Special Prosecutor appointed to investigate the entire eight years of the Bush presidency. We the taxpayers should be assured that there will be criminal indictments handed down if the evidence warrents them, and there should be no language that even suggests the possibility of immunity. I think Nancy Pelosi has stated similar sentiments.

LINK

LINK

The Bush presidency was a daily assault on the Constitution. Bush and those within his inner circle operated with great impunity and they should be held responsible for their actions in every way. Whether or not the Senator's Truth Commission is the way to get justice served is not so important to me as just making sure that, when and if an investigation is ever actually launched, it will be at least as in-depth as the Repubs' investigation into Clinton's dalliances with a White House intern
.

The Bush Family Truth Project

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 Post subject: Re: Sen. Leahy's "Truth Commission" a response to criticism
PostPosted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 2:32 am 
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johndoraemi wrote:
Neither you nor Jesse have offered an alternative to Leahy's proposal.

Your response is particularly defeatist and unhelpful. It's borderline nihilist.

This partisan nonsense about "rethugs" and "war chimp" is also useless. The Democrats are as responsible as the Republicans for the mountains of corpses the US leaves around the world. Both are parties of war criminals. Obama has set his course to continue the tradition of illegal aggressive war. He also retains the program of CIA "rendition" which is subcontracting torture to US client regimes. I'm not sure what the meaning of your banner at the end is, with Obama's face.

Truth is good. If Leahy can get some revealed, that is a start. The alternative is ... nothing.


I have consistently called for the criminal investigation and prosecution of all War Criminals. I would rather be a pragmatic near nihilist than a myopic Polly Anna.

Politics are by their very nature partisan. Criminal Justice in its original form and structure should be blind to politics. This "Truth Commission" is a political entity not a function of Law Enforcement. The support of Repugs ( not "rethugs," I have tried to quote you accurately, I would appreciate you doing the same.) for these wars has been 100%, the support of the Dems has been about 60%, numbers that belie your statement that they are equally responsible. I made a commitment years ago to never refer to the War Chimp with any deference as I believe it only gives him credibility—useless to you, a matter of principle to me. I do believe nothing is better than a vehicle that will whitewash and bury the truth. I note you did not respond to my specific question on your point five.

The meaning of "Glimmer of Hope" should be self evident to anyone aware of the hopeless of the War Chimp. No matter how non-perfect Obama has been, he is head and shoulders above the misery and organized War Crimes of the last eight years.

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