It is currently Tue Sep 02, 2014 6:41 am

All times are UTC - 4 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 22 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2
Author Message
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 2:33 pm 
Offline
SuperMember!
SuperMember!
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 11:58 pm
Posts: 866
Location: Planet Usury
J O M T ...

I agree, but there is more to it then just the FEDs and the USA. Like the IMF and the World bank and etc. Makes little difference when all money is fiat / worthless. The newest fiat is the Euro. Trouble is, the control of the transfer, is in the wrong hands. Basically and I'm no economist, I see it like this - Such a thing as bartering for goods and services is too constraining, something has to act as a currency. You can have two types of currencies: - Fiat currency, which is simply an IOU, with no collateral, or a commodity currency, which is an IOU with collateral. In the latter currency, the commodity to be used must be a universally accepted collateral, capable of being stored in Central Banks, be of a singular grade, and be denominational. Items like cattle, sheep, chickens, lumber, real estate, coal, oil, etc, come in different grades, aren't static, and wouldn't store at Fort Knox. The only workable commodities are the precious metals like gold and silver. Paper Currencies - This allows the Non-Federal - Federal Reserves to expand the money supply at whatever pace they want to. They just print more money, and loosen credit restrictions. They charge interest and compound interest on fiat paper. It cost them nothing as they pulled it out of thin air. We pay taxes into private hands and if late, pay compound interest into the same private hands. A total scam. International Currencies - Their value is determined off the cost of similar goods and services in other countries. A small car that cost 12,000 in the States, should cost the same in say England. Currencies Float - China and India will keep their currencies low to attract business. Canada used to do the same thing and had lots of US business and Tourism was booming. Not so much now, since the Canadian dollar has been floated up in value. A photo center that will print photo graphic prints in India might charge $40.00 for 50 large prints, versus a Canadian or American one charging $150.00 or more. Then there is those Unavoidable Fiscal Time Bombs. Such as Consumer prices increase 1000%, Massive Federal Debt, Social Security, Medicare and etc. So, If the Federal Reserve tightened credit, (Like they did in 1929,) I'm betting we would see a worldwide economic collapse? They would have an excuse and they can create or dream up of plenty of those. Like an Arab terrorist attack weakened the economy, and that, coupled with 'Fiat money', might bring / cause a worldwide depression. Like I said before though, I'm no economist. I hear the those who own the World banks, are selling off much of their holdings. The question is - Why are they selling and who is buying all of it up? I don't need to be an economist to know something big is going on. I wish I was and maybe I could understand it all. Are we going to see another planned 1929 style crash? There is something going on with very large scale Gold sales and etc. If it is going to be like 1929, then we have some knowledge of how it might be carried out. Well, maybe it will go something like this. The big credit squeeze, the world economy will tank, and we will see the greatest wealth transfer in history. International bankers will blame fiat money, aggravated by some kind of 911 even or worse and will clamor for a 'One World Currency'. That currency will be commodity based, and that commodity will be gold. The price of gold is determined by taking the world's debts, liabilities, and money supply, and dividing it by all the gold in the world.
There is problem with that, as a lot of Gold is supposedly hidden in (some) private hands and no one really knows how much there really is. I've heard people say it is far from rare, but they want us to believe it is. Anyway, Gold could become just an equation, and its number could easily be $30,000 an ounce. If one needs to be rescued, and you have $30,000, than that's what a rescue might be worth. Like in 1929, Stocks, bonds, and financial assets will be bought for mere pennies. If a Country had good, honest and decent representatives, there should be no waiting for the international bankers to do anything. They should write off the debt, tell the bankers to piss off, print their own currency, control their own Feds, base the money on gold or silver and keep the international moneylenders out. If they drive their noses in again, then arrest them. There is no doubt that this would turn into a war and the bankers would place a price tag on the heads of their enemies. The representatives of / for the people would be forced to do the same. These representatives would need to be fully protected at all times. These international crooks have a plan and that is the end of the USA as we know it. Canada and Mexico also. Soon, the third World will be good enough for us, like they figure it is for others. Now, who is going to move first - The International Bankers or the people's non-elected Representatives? :roll: It has come to the point of there being just one side, as they control both. As far as I can see, there is no way out, short of what I mentioned above. Not a pretty picture, but that is how I see it.

SI--

_________________
You will know you have spoken the truth when you are angrily denounced; and you will know you have spoken both truly and well when you are visited by the thought police.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 4:11 pm 
Offline
Hear Me Roar!

Joined: Sun Sep 17, 2006 2:45 am
Posts: 384
Location: Surrey, B.C. Famous for many things
Sir,

Indeed, it is not a pretty picture. The creation of all the debt in the U.S. is an ominous scenario. The bankers gain from it by earning interest payments and the politicians just don't care. Maybe it is a coordinated plan to get the U.S. involved in a debt that it cannot repay. Therefore, the Federal Reserve and the other governments of the world simply end up owning the United States. Period. I read an article some time ago outlining the scenario of the creation of a new currency. Maybe you read the article yourself. I saved it on my computer somewhere so I should try and find it and post if for you. Bascially, the article was taking the postion that the bankers ( Federal Reserve if I remember correctly ) would simply issue a new currency since the U.S. dollar would be worthless because no one would want it. They would issue a new currency backed by gold, but certain people would be better off than others under the new currency. Again, I am trying to work from recall here as it was quite some time ago when I read the article, but anyway the bottome line is: the people in the States would end up better than the outside holders of dollars. They would be trading their old worthless U.S. paper in for the new currency. But, the way things work with those in power the insiders would not be hurt as much as the outsiders, in this case the foreign holders of U.S. dollars and debt. Isn't that the kind of thing that they do with stocks; i.e. the insiders always find a way to maintain control? And, when you have the power you can pull these kinds of things off. Is the Federal Reserve such an animal?

_________________
My life is full of optimism and I am not going to stop living until I know the answers to all of the important things, like why does love exist.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 9:34 pm 
Offline
Hear Me Roar!

Joined: Sun Sep 17, 2006 2:45 am
Posts: 384
Location: Surrey, B.C. Famous for many things
Sir,

I was just thinking that my concerns here really belong in the economics and monetary forum, but since I have already got going what the heck. But, the author of the following article does talk about the imperialist ambitions of the U.S at the beginning of his article and the connection of the U.S. dollar to this enterprise. So, I think it is safe to say that we are talking about the same thing here, the dominance and worldly ambitions of the U.S.

Anyway, I found that article I was referring to earlier. I have it stored on my computer along with an article by Ron Paul and another person interested the viability of the U.S. dollar.

Source of article here:

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0610/S00236.htm

Quote:
The world is on the verge of experiencing the controlled destabilization and collapse of the US Dollar, which will be replaced by a “New Dollar” backed by Official “Good Gold.” The primary driving forces behind this global process are the Bush Administration allied to major private financial-industrial interests in the United States and elsewhere, focused on private Overworld geopolitical planning emanating from a network of think tanks, primarily the New York-based Council on Foreign Relations.

Quote:
The “New Dollar” is coming!

“Plan B” has a second part. Sometime during the next 12 to 24 months, our TV screens will tune in to CNN, CBS, BBC, CNBC, Fox and other world media as they announce urgent “Breaking News” involving important financial developments amid growing panic and dark rumours. Such news will come on a Friday afternoon, after 4 or 5 PM when the New York Stock Exchange and banks in New York City have closed. We will learn that Alan Greenspan – probably accompanied by Treasury Secretary John Show – have a very important announcement to make to the people of the United States and the world. His speech will be short, terse and filled with carefully selected banking jargon.

Greenspan will state something along the lines that “in an effort to uphold and reinforce the US economy and that of its key allies; to protect consumer interests and those of major corporations; to preserve the international financial system and to thwart a potential financial meltdown; to balance the Budget and avoid a stock market collapse, the United States will effective immediately implement a far-reaching Economic Reform and Financial overhaul, declaring an extended banking and exchange holiday”. In Argentina, we have lot’s of experience on this!.

He will then inform that President George W. Bush, with the full support of Congress, will sign a series of emergency executive orders whereby the US Dollar will be placed on a Gold Standard. Correspondingly, this will necessitate introducing a New Dollar convertible into metallic gold and this new currency shall replace all the “old dollars” in circulation which, as we have seen, are only backed by worthless paper, i.e., Fiat money. What’s going to happen with those “old” dollars? They will have to exchanged for New Dollars, of course.

All persons holding US Dollar Notes and Treasury instruments who are citizens of the US or are domiciled in the US, together with US corporations, and persons, corporations and organizations domiciled in countries allied to the US (most notably, the United Kingdom and State of Israel) shall have their “old” Dollars exchanged for New Dollars on a 1-to-1 parity.

In the rest of the world – i.e., Asia-Pacific, Central and South America, Africa, Russia, the Muslim World – changing “old” Dollars for New ones will depend on the local “exchange markets” which will fix the “proper” rate of exchange between the extremely plentiful “old” Dollars and the extremely scarce New Dollars. And what will that rate of exchange be? One-to-one? I doubt it, because supply and demand will set in almost as fast as panic. Two “old” Dollars for One New Dollar, then? Or, maybe, 3-to-1? Or 5-to-1? Or 10-to-1? Who knows? “Let the laws of the free-market economy – supply and demand – do their bidding”. And whatever happens elsewhere will certainly not be the concern of the US.

We will then see millions upon millions of desperate and panicky people, companies, banks, operators, players of all sorts throughout the planet running amok all at the same time trying to unload their “old” Dollars and exchange them for New Dollars. Again, in Argentina we have a huge amount of experience on this…

Alan Greenspan is definitely the man to micromanage this whole process, with the political support and backing of president George W, Bush, because he has always been a Gold Standard buff, since a long, long time ago. One of his first key academic articles dating back to 1967 proposed just that: placing the US Dollar on a Gold Standard.

And then along came the Euro

_________________
My life is full of optimism and I am not going to stop living until I know the answers to all of the important things, like why does love exist.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 10:58 pm 
Offline
SuperMember!
SuperMember!
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 11:58 pm
Posts: 866
Location: Planet Usury
Just One More Thing.... wrote:
[size=18]Sir,

Indeed, it is not a pretty picture. The creation of all the debt in the U.S. is an ominous scenario. The bankers gain from it by earning interest payments and the politicians just don't care. Maybe it is a coordinated plan to get the U.S. involved in a debt that it cannot repay.


Yes, that part is over, this is how they always get control, via Debt. They know it can't be paid back. So much for the fiat system. Those who just don't care, have always been with us. They always will be. They care not for freedom and decent life.

"If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen." -- Samuel Adams

Now, we can see clearly why they wanted to keep them out of the Country to begin with. The Country lost and they won. All our representatives are subservient to them. They have been for a very long time.


Just One More Thing.... wrote:
[size=18] Therefore, the Federal Reserve and the other governments of the world simply end up owning the United States. Period. I read an article some time ago outlining the scenario of the creation of a new currency. Maybe you read the article yourself. I saved it on my computer somewhere so I should try and find it and post if for you. Bascially, the article was taking the postion that the bankers ( Federal Reserve if I remember correctly ) would simply issue a new currency since the U.S. dollar would be worthless because no one would want it. They would issue a new currency backed by gold, but certain people would be better off than others under the new currency. Again, I am trying to work from recall here as it was quite some time ago when I read the article, but anyway the bottome line is: the people in the States would end up better than the outside holders of dollars. They would be trading their old worthless U.S. paper in for the new currency. But, the way things work with those in power the insiders would not be hurt as much as the outsiders, in this case the foreign holders of U.S. dollars and debt.


I understand and Yes, that would be fine if a decent governMint did so per Country. The International Bankers are always the big winners and not Countries or Govenments. The International crooks want a Global World with Global Currency. A system that works for them and not us, meaning .. The people anywhere. Then, what is to stop them from turning it into a World of Tax slaves? In other words, a turd World. We just trust them? Don't we know their track record already? I think we do. Right now, they need to get rid of the US and it's Constitution. They will when they get a NA-Union or just write off the Constitution and do (more aggressively) what ever they want to.

Just One More Thing.... wrote:
[size=18] Isn't that the kind of thing that they do with stocks; i.e. the insiders always find a way to maintain control? And, when you have the power you can pull these kinds of things off. Is the Federal Reserve such an animal?


Yes and it is how they steal wealth. They say the Feds hold nothing really and they just play their part in the fiat system. Anyway, Those who had the most money (or rather the wealth it represented) had the greatest control and power. That's what the chase after riches was all about; wasn't it?

_________________
You will know you have spoken the truth when you are angrily denounced; and you will know you have spoken both truly and well when you are visited by the thought police.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 12:11 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat May 29, 2004 11:46 pm
Posts: 14444
Location: NC
Remember GORBECHEV? He's now coming out...against BUSH. His comments are spot on.

[url=http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19994563/]Gorbachev says U.S. is sowing world ‘disorder’

Ex-Soviet premier blasts Bush as helping create ‘very dangerous’ situation
[/url]

MOSCOW - Former Soviet president Mikhail Gorbachev criticized the United States, and President Bushin particular, on Friday for sowing disorder across the world by seeking to build an empire.

Gorbachev, who presided over the break-up of the Soviet Union, said Washington had sought to build an empire after the Cold War ended but had failed to understand the changing world.

“The Americans then gave birth to the idea of a new empire, world leadership by a single power, and what followed?” Gorbachev asked reporters at a news conference in Moscow.

What has followed are unilateral actions, what has followed are wars, what has followed is ignoring the U.N. Security Council, ignoring international law and ignoring the will of the people, even the American people,” he said.

Image

_________________
Image

"Behind every great fortune lies a great crime."
Honore de Balzac

"Democrats work to help people who need help.
That other party, they work for people who don't need help.
That's all there is to it."

~Harry S. Truman


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 1:48 pm 
Offline
Hear Me Roar!

Joined: Sun Sep 17, 2006 2:45 am
Posts: 384
Location: Surrey, B.C. Famous for many things

Of course Gorby is right. The U.S. is on a destructive path. If only the American people would turn off their televisions ( like I have ) maybe they would begin to see the true nature of their president and the chaos he is causing in the world.

From the article you supplied Catherine:

He said the U.S. administration was apparently unable to adapt to a swiftly changing world and had ignored — or was unable to see — the rise of Brazil, Russia, India and China as economic heavyweights.

Gorby is right. There are economic challengers to the hegemony to the U.S. out there. I read an article not too long ago that suggested that these countries will have a total economy ( GDP ) larger than the U.S. in the future thus representing a threat to the U.S. and its global ambitions.

I believe this to be the main mistake of administration such as that of Bush. They just don't realize or care about its powerful competitors and their aspirations.

_________________
My life is full of optimism and I am not going to stop living until I know the answers to all of the important things, like why does love exist.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 2:24 pm 
Offline
SuperMember!
SuperMember!
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 13, 2005 12:50 am
Posts: 1456
Location: Ct.
Or perhaps they all know what they are doing.

Quote:
The aide said that guys like me were ''in what we call the reality-based community,'' which he defined as people who ''believe that solutions emerge from your judicious study of discernible reality.'' I nodded and murmured something about enlightenment principles and empiricism. He cut me off. ''That's not the way the world really works anymore,'' he continued. ''We're an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality. And while you're studying that reality -- judiciously, as you will -- we'll act again, creating other new realities, which you can study too, and that's how things will sort out. We're history's actors . . . and you, all of you, will be left to just study what we do.''


I reflect on this quote quiet a bit. It is a very powerful statment...very powerful indeed.

This is something that we could delve very deeply into. If we chose to delve deep enough it could bring us to a whole new realm of understanding.

Instead we hardly scratch the surface.

_________________
CrimsonEagle
The war to end all wars can only be fought on the front-lines of the mind.

The greatest deception they have perpetrated is that we need them. Our greatest mistake is that we believe them.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 22 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2

All times are UTC - 4 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Blue Moon by Trent © 2007
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group