my reply to nina was, how can i put it.....a little ball breaking. so, don't take my reply literally. i think she knows i was just teasing her with that one.

hehe, e-sarcasm can be hard to pick up sometimes.

Had a couple of minutes and thought I better check out what was going on here. Yeah mga I knew what you were doing, just as I was also giving you grief too. Sorry Jobot, I threw your name into the pot since you had also posted. MGA and myself have been friends a long time and like to pick on each other. Anyway, always some truth in jest though. I was sincere in the part about being careful not to generalize about christians. It's the same thing when people generalize and say atheists have no morals. Just not a true statement. My father is a very moral person and yet an atheist. Oh mga you asked me not to lie about the minister telling who to vote for. It is true. In all my years I do not remember ever hearing a minister at my church saying who to vote for. Even when a member of the congregation is running for an office! Like today.....the minister did tell us to go and vote and to vote our consciences. Did you know that there are people in my church that are democrats and even run for political offices?! They are even christians! Yep, christian democrats. Oh hey, we do agree...I am very glad there is seperation of church and state. Just like many don't believe in God I don't want to be forced by the state to practice a religion I may feel is false. Thus better to seperate church and state.

If you notice from my posts I don't specifically point out christians as forcing their views...I say religious people, and I believe it. Whether they all do it to the same extent or not, all religious people want people to believe what they do. ...because their beliefs are right....or is it theirs?..or theirs?...oh, no, no theirs!



I do believe that you are among the few in that group.

Their are "blind religious followers" and their are religious people. The blind believe anything they are told to believe. They do anything they are told to do.

Religious people have faith while seeking and reading (for themselves) and can be open minded and human. I believe it is wrong to lie. If my grandaughter asks me if I like her new haircut (and I really don't like it) I am going to lie. I would rather "be wrong" in telling that lie than to see that little face fall in dismay because I was "so righteous" and just HAD to tell the truth.

I am religious and who am I to tell someone else they are wrong? What if I turn out to be wrong? I am always seeking, reading, doubting, and praying for answers. Right now I am ashamed of those who profess to be Christians (you know, those who are full of hate) and I don't want to be put in the same catagory with them.

no problem, ny...i have done the same many times.

Not to open a can of worms, but what if you are wrong about god even existing? What if he doesnt? Have you ever honestly explored that option?

Sure have. What if I believed in God and he doesn't exist? So what? Nothing lost, nothing gained.

What if I did NOT believe in God and there REALLY was one? I would have to spend eternity in hell. Don't like that option.

It appears there is more to lose by not believing.

I am not one to preach. You choose your path and I choose mine. There is room for both of us on this planet and we can get along.

Geez here we go again. I hate this stupid shit you people throw out all the time about "At least I'm not going to hell." Fuck that.
What kind of god would let people who simply didn't believe in him go to hell?... They're good, honest, hardworking people, but they don't believe in him, so TO HELL THEY GO!!!
You choose your path and I choose mine? Fine. Then quit telling people they're going to hell for not believing.

See - I didn't say that. Was there a little R spin there? I said that is the way I BELIEVE. Who is shoving whose beliefs on whom? I am not asking you to join me in mine. But you are making fun of me. Now who is making who look bad? I thought atheists lived and let live, as I do. Am I wrong?

I think we are still free in this country (for the time being) to believe the way we want to. I haven't said anything hateful to you or made fun of you. I haven't preached to you or forced my opinions on you or cursed at you. Why are you so angry? Take a chill.

Go back and look over all of my posts. I have never tried to force my opinions on anyone. I have never been a religious zealot and condemned all the atheists (here) to hell. Why are you condeming me? Is is that your way of trying to convert me?

This is true, however I do have many issues with religion and its effects on society. I see its negative effects as vastly outweighing its positive effects, and in that respect i would like to eliminate it.

ok everyone....the OP was about the court backing an atheists point of view about certain religious statements within the government.

let's all get back on topic or this thread closes. admittedly, even i got off topic playing with nina. but, let's talk about whether there should be "under god" in our pledge.

Gotta reply to this mga....


OMG! Am I the first one to curse in this forum? lol

First...I never once "made fun" of you. I may have "made fun" of your god for being so damn hateful towards people that he'd send them to hell for not believing in him, though.

Second...When did I shove my beliefs on you? You did shove yours on me though when you said "What if I did NOT believe in God and there REALLY was one? I would have to spend eternity in hell. Don't like that option." You're telling me that I'm going to hell right there, whether you want to admit to it or not. And with that, are preaching and forcing your beliefs on me. You may not have never, in your previous posts, condemned athiests to hell or forced your religious opinions, but with that last post, you did. ...And converting you?...give me a break.