I am done defending my position with someone who doesn't have kids. Come back and talk when you do.
What do you say NYG?
Well, I almost forgot, we all were not kids at one time. I would figure that experience would trump that of being a parent.
You talk about the difference between "discipline" and "abuse"
This reminds me, some people see the death penalty as "justice", i see it as "murder"
The problem here is perception. You may see it as discipline, but how does the kid see it?
Just ask anyone who works with kids. Ask a cop, a teacher, a doctor, a librarian, or anyone else who comes in contact with kids everyday.
I asked 14 people today if they ever spanked their kids. Granted, 6 of them were teachers. 100% said yes and they would do it again.
Appeal to authority. Just because these people do it, still doesnt make it right. Constant contact with kids doesnt make one an expert on child behavior.
So, what do the experts say?
Here is what an American Psychological Society study said:
WASHINGTON -- Corporal punishment remains a widely used discipline technique in most American families, but it has also been a subject of controversy within the child development and psychological communities. In a large-scale meta-analysis of 88 studies, psychologist Elizabeth Thompson Gershoff, PhD, of the National Center for Children in Poverty at Columbia University, looked at both positive and negative behaviors in children that were associated with corporal punishment. Her research and commentaries on her work are published in the July issue of Psychological Bulletin, published by the American Psychological Association....
Gershoff found "strong associations" between corporal punishment and all eleven child behaviors and experiences. Ten of the associations were negative such as with increased child aggression and antisocial behavior. The single desirable association was between corporal punishment and increased immediate compliance on the part of the child.
The two largest effect sizes (strongest associations) were immediate compliance by the child and physical abuse of the child by the parent. Gershoff believes that these two strongest associations model the complexity of the debate around corporal punishment.
"That these two disparate constructs should show the strongest links to corporal punishment underlines the controversy over this practice. There is general consensus that corporal punishment is effective in getting children to comply immediately while at the same time there is caution from child abuse researchers that corporal punishment by its nature can escalate into physical maltreatment," Gershoff writes....
While the nature of the analyses prohibits causally linking corporal punishment with the child behaviors, Gershoff also summarizes a large body of literature on parenting that suggests why corporal punishment may actually cause negative outcomes for children. For one, corporal punishment on its own does not teach children right from wrong. Secondly, although it makes children afraid to disobey when parents are present, when parents are not present to administer the punishment those same children will misbehave.
In commentary published along with the Gershoff study, George W. Holden, PhD, of the University of Texas at Austin, writes that Gershoff's findings "reflect the growing body of evidence indicating that corporal punishment does no good and may even cause harm." Holden submits that the psychological community should not be advocating spanking as a discipline tool for parents....