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 Post subject: WAS NIXON WORSE?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2006 2:02 pm 
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Was Nixon Worse?


Dec 11, 2006

Composite: MediaSpin White House Photo: Eric Draper

By Jon Wiener

Is George W. Bush the worst president in U.S. history? Or is it Richard Nixon? That question is being debated by historians ranging from Eric Foner and David Greenberg in the Washington Post to Sean Wilentz in Rolling Stone. Usually Bush is named worst because, although Nixon abused the power of the presidency, he also did some good things, like opening relations with China and approving the Environmental Protection Agency. Bush in contrast not only started the Iraq war; he also approved the use of torture; he claimed the right not to follow laws he disagrees with; and he abolished fundamental rights for the accused, including trial by jury.

There is, however, one extremely simple measure of who was worse, summed up in the question that antiwar demonstrators asked LBJ back in the 1960s: How many kids did you kill today? We can compare the number of casualties in wars that are unjust and disastrous. If we compare the death toll in Vietnam under Nixon with the death toll in Iraq under Bush, it appears that Nixon was worse.

American deaths in war are counted carefully. For Nixon’s presidency, 1969-1974, the official Vietnam war total is 21,041. American deaths in Iraq (as of Dec. 10) total 2,932. By this measure, Nixon was far worse.

Of course the deaths of Vietnamese and Iraqis should also be counted. The U.S. is not counting Iraqi casualties, but the best estimate of Iraqi deaths (as of July 2006) is 650,000. That’s the figure Johns Hopkins demographers reported in The Lancet in October, using the most advanced survey research and statistical techniques.

Bush might defend himself by arguing that, according to The Lancet study, the majority of the 650,000 Iraqi deaths were not caused by the U.S. He’d be right about that—but Iraqis wouldn’t be engaged in a civil war now if Bush had not invaded in 2003.


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READ MORE OF THIS DEBATE HERE

Personally, I think Bush is the WORST. PRESIDENT. EVER...regardless of litmus tests like the numbers of troops or civilians killed. Bush is in a category by himself within American history. We only have dictators to compare him to...and that would be Stalin and Hitler at the top of the list. So far, Americans haven't had to answer to a bona-fide dictator since we revolted against George III. Ironic that the worst prez ever is also named George... :roll: AND George Bush would LOVE to be dictator of the US...he's not gone yet, either. A lot can happen between now and November, 2008.

AND the war in Iraq isn't over...and if Bush has his way, it never will be.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2006 9:50 pm 
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Quote:
Personally, I think Bush is the WORST. PRESIDENT. EVER...regardless of litmus tests like the numbers of troops or civilians killed. Bush is in a category by himself within American history. We only have dictators to compare him to...and that would be Stalin and Hitler at the top of the list. So far, Americans haven't had to answer to a bona-fide dictator since we revolted against George III. Ironic that the worst prez ever is also named George... Rolling Eyes AND George Bush would LOVE to be dictator of the US...he's not gone yet, either. A lot can happen between now and November, 2008.


I agree 100% Cat. I actually like the bumper sticker: Never thought I would miss Nixon

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 Post subject: BUSH IS THE WORST
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2006 6:39 am 
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In October, I wrote the following article:

I Never Thought I Would Miss Nixon……Then Again

There is no doubt, Bush is the worst by far, if for no other reason than he is so stupid not to realize the harm he has caused and continues to cause. This is giving him the benefit of a doubt that it is stupidity of course, the alternative is that he is just one evil bastard.

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Last edited by A Proud Liberal on Thu Dec 14, 2006 10:24 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2006 9:44 am 
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American deaths in war are counted carefully.


I don't have any links right this minute, but I will look for them today. Too early yet...anyhow, I am certain I have read reports that show the American death toll as a result of the Iraq war is much higher than reported because they only count war deaths as those who die on the ground of Iraq; those who die in the air on the way to Germany aren't counted, those who die in Germany aren't counted...etc. Not that (hopefully) this would inflate the death toll enough to compete with Viet Nam, but it would show a more realistic number of deaths. Now if I can only find some links to back this up...I'll go dig around.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2006 10:22 am 
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I am going to start a new thread about this, as to not hijack this one. :)

I will call it "Undercounting the dead in Iraq"


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2006 10:25 am 
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DO.g's did a wonderful job with the information you're referring to, lefty, in this post:

http://tvnewslies.org/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=2169

Scroll down until you find the post I'm talking about.

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