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PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2005 8:01 pm 
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Speaking My Mind
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Catherine wrote:
Look at George Bush and the Neocons, standing on the bible while they declare war on an innocent people. Look at their supporters, cheering them on. :roll:


They're not Christian.

Christians strive to be like Christ.

Bush and his ilk strive to be like Judas; sell anything, including integrity, for some money.

And his followers strive to be the Pharisees.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 10, 2005 3:01 am 
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Sotek wrote:
Catherine wrote:
Look at George Bush and the Neocons, standing on the bible while they declare war on an innocent people. Look at their supporters, cheering them on. :roll:


They're not Christian.

Christians strive to be like Christ.

Bush and his ilk strive to be like Judas; sell anything, including integrity, for some money.

And his followers strive to be the Pharisees.


The Gannonites are the NEW Pharisees...

:twisted:

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 6:43 pm 
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Quote:
Question: A Christian who trains people to bomb other people. What kind of religion teaches one to select this path in life?
I am not sure. I do not think Jesus taught this.
Quote:
Did Jesus have a militia?
I do not think He did in the way you might be thinking.
Quote:
Did Jesus create the F18 so that you can use it to slam a 500lb. bomb into a populated city?
I think not.
Quote:
Did Jesus create depleated uranium so that his followers can cover a nation full of men women and children with it?
I am not sure why uranium is here so I do not have an answer to that. I wonder if God knew Satan would rebel.
Quote:
Did Jesus teach your people all these wonderful ways to make the world a miserable hateful death filled place?
I think not.

I do not plan to come back here so I do not expect an answer, but what do you know about freemasonry and the Novus Ordo Seclorum? Look at the back of the dollar if you want to and find a valid latin-english translation for yourself. Peace.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 8:38 pm 
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The phrase Novus Ordo Seclorum (Latin for "New Order of the Ages") was originally a motto of freemasonry. It appears on the reverse of the Great Seal of the United States, first publicly revealed in 1782 and printed on the back of the American dollar bill since 1935. It is also the motto of the Yale School of Management, Yale University's business school. It is often thought, incorrectly, to mean "New World Order"; however, the exact Latin translation for that phrase is "Novus Ordo Mundi."

The sentence contains a mispelling as it should read: Novus Ordo Secolorum. Some authors believe the dropping of the o has been done on purpose by the followers of freemasonry to achieve a numerological and geometrical double meaning.

source:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Novus_Ordo_Seclorum

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 Post subject: The ones who support bush, war, bombings and etc.
PostPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 11:31 pm 
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The ones who support bush, war, bombings and etc.

Christians for Bush or whatever ..

I can tell you all from the experiences I've had talking with them, that there is no way you can win in a conversation or argument. When it comes to the bible and Jesus they always quote the Bible and tell me it is the way it must be. I've tried to talk about peace and other ways around wars and etc, but nothing doing. No turning the other cheek, just support war and Bush.

To be quite honest, I've given up.

I used to be a Christian at one time, but that's another story.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 9:23 am 
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It has been noted by Christian Theologians that Christians (as a practicing population) know LESS about their religion than ANY OTHER GROUP. Most of them (the theologians) see this as a problem that must be addressed if Christianity is to fullfill its (ostensive) mission.

There have been incidents (in actual churches) of things like

and Jesus said "kill them all, the Father will know his own" *- John 34:15

AND getting away with it because NO ONE in the community knew enough bible (or even how to source the quote) to prove otherwise!

*the example given here is absurdly over the top to illustrate a point (it is not an actual quote from The Gospel of John).

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 Post subject: Re: The ones who support bush, war, bombings and etc.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 4:28 pm 
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Sir-Irate wrote:
The ones who support bush, war, bombings and etc.

Christians for Bush or whatever ..

I can tell you all from the experiences I've had talking with them, that there is no way you can win in a conversation or argument. When it comes to the bible and Jesus they always quote the Bible and tell me it is the way it must be. I've tried to talk about peace and other ways around wars and etc, but nothing doing. No turning the other cheek, just support war and Bush.

To be quite honest, I've given up.

I used to be a Christian at one time, but that's another story.

--


Try using Matthew 25: 31-46 on them, Sir Irate... I bet they scurry away from it and you like the cockroaches they are...

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 4:31 pm 
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Alkemi wrote:
It has been noted by Christian Theologians that Christians (as a practicing population) know LESS about their religion than ANY OTHER GROUP. Most of them (the theologians) see this as a problem that must be addressed if Christianity is to fullfill its (ostensive) mission.

There have been incidents (in actual churches) of things like

and Jesus said "kill them all, the Father will know his own" *- John 34:15

AND getting away with it because NO ONE in the community knew enough bible (or even how to source the quote) to prove otherwise!

*the example given here is absurdly over the top to illustrate a point (it is not an actual quote from The Gospel of John).


Sometimes all you need is the right tool... in this case, for at least as long as they allow us access to it, we have the web...
Holy Bible

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 6:42 am 
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i didn't read everything in this thread but i grew up in a very christian household, then drifted away from it, and after growing a bit older and seeing how things in my life worked out, i came back to it.

let me first say, that the politicians in general USE christianity to get votes, anyone who has half a brain can see this.

what i believe is you've not only got to sift through the warping of christianity by people throughout time and take it for what it is, at it's core.
more generally it's more of a moral code to live by, don't lie, don't cheat on your wife/husband, don't kill people....etc.

at it's core it's good, but like most of anything else it's been warped by people to fit their own agenda.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 4:38 pm 
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Yes, but what morals does it actually teach to a majority of christians? That our god is right and the only one invariably, is the great moralistic conclusion. There is only one god and you see it our way. Same message as was always preached no matter who was top dog.

These morals you talk about were established long before the O.T. was written(Around 650 B.C.), or civilization could not have been founded. Giving the bible the credit for establishing the morals and values we have today is like saying that god is responsible for things like greco/roman laws, the dark ages, the magna carta, the renaissance, the enlightenment ,civil laws of France and common laws of England as well as the confrontational laws of America. All laws grew from previous ideas that established precedents for actions, and long before there was one god, there were laws being established. The Egyptians were writing laws and inventing gods 1000's of years before the Hebrews set of borrowed laws down, or devised their one god theory.

By the beginning of the Old Kingdom Dynasty (3100 BC), a national religion developed out of the primitive tribal and local religions. However, ongoing changes in political power resulted in the changing status of Egyptian gods.

Generally, as different cities or regions became politically dominant, their particular god also became dominant. Many Egyptian gods find their origin in several of the Egyptian creation myths. These myths attempted to explain the Egyptians' place in the cosmos based on the observation of natural processes. Ancient Egyptian religion was an ever-changing mishmash of several Egyptian gods and tribal and regional traditions. As a result, there were several conflicting beliefs. Over time, these conflicts were reconciled and a trend towards monotheism developed. This trend reached its zenith during the reign of Amenhotep IV 1369-1332 BC: (Akhenaten)- when he established Aten as the only universal god. This concept went against thousands of years of Egyptian religious tradition. The one god concept ended soon after hisdeath. The worship of multiple gods was fully reinstated during the reign of a boy king named Tutankhaten (Tut). However, the concepts of divine creation and life after death are at least common themes.

A prevailing thought is that Egyptian gods, like all gods and religious belief systems, developed as a result of mankind attempting to explain the physical world. Another thought is that all humans are born with the innate understanding of the existence of a sovereign Creator, and that many ancient religions sprouted as a result of this universal truth. Seeking out a meaning and purpose to life is a common human experience.

Akhenaten is principally famous for his religious reforms, where the polytheism of Egypt was to be supplanted by monotheism centered around Aten, the god of the solar disc. This was possibly a move to lessen the political power of the Priests. Now the Pharaoh, not the priesthood, was the sole link between the people and Aten which effectively ended the power of the various temples.

Akhenaten built a temple to his god Aten immediately outside the east gate of the temple of Amun at Karnak, but clearly the coexistence of the two cults could not last. He therefore proscribed the cult of Amun, closed the god's temples, took over the revenues. He then sent his officials around to destroy Amun's statues and to desecrate the worship sites. These actions were so contrary to the traditional that opposition arose against him. As is a common theme in history, the church ansd state must be of one mind to succeed. They work best when in common agreement. Thus Bush uses religious belief to justify his politics, and establish a blend of tyranny with morals and values.

Gods have been at war with each other for thousands of years. If the Romans hadn't adopted christianity to replace their outdated gods then we wouldn't be following it either. Soon this phony religious structure will be replaced by something more realistic hopefully. One based in tolerance, conscience and equality, not fear, intolerance and ignorance.

Politicians use religion to control people. Belief works, not becase it is true, but because it works. All religions are warped. Christianity has warped through so many changes that no one really knows what it was originally intended to be. The information is made to fit the mold as required and so it develops a chamelion like structure.

Like you said, it has been warped to fit agendas. Like Hitler and the German theologians did before WW2.

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